A Capoeira Social Network
My fustration with Capoeira in General...
Hi all...
I've been really contemplating coming back to Capoeira. I really would like to come back and train capoeira angola... but i have soo many things that i don't agree with that hinders me from committing myself to train with any established group. I thought maybe i'd share with you all my frustration and my struggle with capoeira... some of what i will share has everything to do with why i left capoeira... I won't go great into detail only kind of list what I am not in agreement with. at the end i will also share i what i love about capoeira....
Don't Agree With:
1. Cordel System, i just don't need to be ranked or compared with anyone, we are all smart enough with enough common sense to distinguish who is more experienced without cordels
2. Titles, we don't need all these titles with the exception of Mestre if the students so choose to call their teacher their Mestre
3. Uniform\ Color Cloth, i don't agree that we all need to wear white or any other particular color in order to train with any particular capoeira group. White is a tradition carried over from Candomle and Church. I'm an atheist... i will not wear white and represent something i am not, and something i don't believe in, how i present myself is very important to me, im sure it is important to everyone and of coarse all the capoeira mestres who ask you to wear white or their particular school uniform color for whatever reason...
capoeira flurished in the streets of brazil, some people had no shoes, had no clothing, but still trained capoeira and i highly doubt what you wore had any significance to training or playing capoeira, why should it matter now? we don't need this much structure to share an art form with people.
4. Songs about GODs, Saints, or Spirits... once again im Athiest I will never again sing a song that does not mean anything to me, if i don't believe in something, i will not partake in it.... instructors still felt the need to disrespect me by asking me to sing a song about something i did not believe in...
5. Roda, I don't believe anyone should ever be told how to play capoeira in any roda... you should not be asked to tuck in your shirt, tuck in your belt, wear shoes, don't wear shoes, this is all a bunch bullshit... why are we telling other capoeira players how they should present and express themselves in a roda???? if you play and train capoeira with no t-shirt, in a sports bra, no shoes, with shoes, belt or no belt, you should always play and train that way anywhere.... what is the need for all this formality and traditional bullshit... lets just allow people to play capoeira, present and express themselves honestly at all times....
This just about sums up everything i don't agree with... and it applies to all capoeira today regional, contemporay, and angola....
I just want to train, and play capoeira without all the extra bullshit...
What i loveabout capoeira is the exchange between the players in the roda, the dance element, the idea of a martial art disguised in a dance, and the music... I think many people love and persue capoeira because of these same things...
what i don't understand is why can't we just embrace these elements of capoeira, continue to share it, allow others to freely express themselves in this art form, and just take away all the extra nonsense... all the things i just mentioned above that pushes people like me away because i'm not willing to conform to and honor these so called traditions that honestly i feel without it capoeira could still be just as strong possibly or even stronger...
Now i know some of you will bring up a good point regarding the structure of capoeira, that it was necessary so that capoeira could be recognized as sport or martial art by the government. I understand the reason why Mestre Bimba may have asked his students to wear all white, and create some serious structure to make capoeira look good in front of the government, but come on.... we are way past those times... and capoeira is all over the world today because of this mans efforts and others who followed after him...
my understanding of capoeira is this.... it is an art form that was born out the fight for freedom from slavery... if this is capoeira, then why are we enslaving students of capoeira on many levels with all these rules?
I've been really contemplating coming back to Capoeira. I really would like to come back and train capoeira angola... but i have soo many things that i don't agree with that hinders me from committing myself to train with any established group. I thought maybe i'd share with you all my frustration and my struggle with capoeira... some of what i will share has everything to do with why i left capoeira... I won't go great into detail only kind of list what I am not in agreement with. at the end i will also share i what i love about capoeira....
Don't Agree With:
1. Cordel System, i just don't need to be ranked or compared with anyone, we are all smart enough with enough common sense to distinguish who is more experienced without cordels
2. Titles, we don't need all these titles with the exception of Mestre if the students so choose to call their teacher their Mestre
3. Uniform\ Color Cloth, i don't agree that we all need to wear white or any other particular color in order to train with any particular capoeira group. White is a tradition carried over from Candomle and Church. I'm an atheist... i will not wear white and represent something i am not, and something i don't believe in, how i present myself is very important to me, im sure it is important to everyone and of coarse all the capoeira mestres who ask you to wear white or their particular school uniform color for whatever reason...
capoeira flurished in the streets of brazil, some people had no shoes, had no clothing, but still trained capoeira and i highly doubt what you wore had any significance to training or playing capoeira, why should it matter now? we don't need this much structure to share an art form with people.
4. Songs about GODs, Saints, or Spirits... once again im Athiest I will never again sing a song that does not mean anything to me, if i don't believe in something, i will not partake in it.... instructors still felt the need to disrespect me by asking me to sing a song about something i did not believe in...
5. Roda, I don't believe anyone should ever be told how to play capoeira in any roda... you should not be asked to tuck in your shirt, tuck in your belt, wear shoes, don't wear shoes, this is all a bunch bullshit... why are we telling other capoeira players how they should present and express themselves in a roda???? if you play and train capoeira with no t-shirt, in a sports bra, no shoes, with shoes, belt or no belt, you should always play and train that way anywhere.... what is the need for all this formality and traditional bullshit... lets just allow people to play capoeira, present and express themselves honestly at all times....
This just about sums up everything i don't agree with... and it applies to all capoeira today regional, contemporay, and angola....
I just want to train, and play capoeira without all the extra bullshit...
What i loveabout capoeira is the exchange between the players in the roda, the dance element, the idea of a martial art disguised in a dance, and the music... I think many people love and persue capoeira because of these same things...
what i don't understand is why can't we just embrace these elements of capoeira, continue to share it, allow others to freely express themselves in this art form, and just take away all the extra nonsense... all the things i just mentioned above that pushes people like me away because i'm not willing to conform to and honor these so called traditions that honestly i feel without it capoeira could still be just as strong possibly or even stronger...
Now i know some of you will bring up a good point regarding the structure of capoeira, that it was necessary so that capoeira could be recognized as sport or martial art by the government. I understand the reason why Mestre Bimba may have asked his students to wear all white, and create some serious structure to make capoeira look good in front of the government, but come on.... we are way past those times... and capoeira is all over the world today because of this mans efforts and others who followed after him...
my understanding of capoeira is this.... it is an art form that was born out the fight for freedom from slavery... if this is capoeira, then why are we enslaving students of capoeira on many levels with all these rules?
Views: 212
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Ramses Hernandez Aguirre on -
well maybe you dont belive in those things but the mestres who is teaching you DOES, so you have to respect that, iam atheist too, but i belive in respecting others belifs, even if i dont and about cordas and abadas, white color etc, i really dont care, i just want to learn capoeira, but anyway as i said, everybody have their beliefs
p.d. sorry if my english isnt good, im mexican ;)
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Permalink Reply by Jon on
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it seems you are assuming that i have no respect for others beliefs.... where did i show any sign of disrespect to anyones belief? i am merely stating my opinion and why i could not continue with capoeira because i choose not to conform to the rules and traditions of capoeira...
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Permalink Reply by Ramses Hernandez Aguirre on
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well dont take me the wrong way, im just saying that if you left capoeira beacuse you think that followin all those mestres traditions and beliefs goes against your own, well thats bad,
you are saying that you like to train capoeira but without all that "bullshit", well you can, but not necessarily blaming the mestres (and students etc) beliefs bout the spirit, gods, colors,structure etc etc.
Capoeira es para todos/Capoeira is 4 everbody
well, to me the thing with capoeira is art, excersie, tradition, respect, joy, history and a lot more....
thats why i like to play with all kind of capoeirstas, even if they have a totally diferent way of seeing capoeira
but anyway im only stating my opinion too por que amo y me encanta la capoeira.
peace and have a nice day.
p.d. sorry if the english sucks.
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Permalink Reply by Reg on -
Hey Jon, I actually understand completely what you're talking about. I've had issues with the "rules" of capoeira for a long time. Before I joined any school, I trained for a year in the park wearing whatever I wanted and feeling the freedom of capoeira on the grass. Once I joined a group, it became evident that something changed. I love capoeira and the taste of freedom that I experienced during that year has stayed with me forever and salts my game wherever I play. You have options, friend. You could always gather a group of people who wouldn't mind playing in a park for hours moving within their own rhythms and actually creating something really nice. Then capoeira will be yours - and you will get out of it everything you expected to in the first place.
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Wow! Thx you for your response Reg! I really appreciate it... nice to know im not alone. I still havent trained for sometime, but capoeira is very much apart of my dance today... i dance mostly today because i've found the sort of freedom of expression i was seeking... but i am still drawn to capoeira no matter how many years pass... your right and mayve someday i'll do just as you suggested! Thx you
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Permalink Reply by Pavio Preto on -
Come to think of it, I've had NO desire to participate in my Capoeira group lately, and thus, my attendance has been third rate. I'm beginning to realize that I just simply don't agree with 90% of what comes out of my teacher's mouth. His students who have become Mestres and succeeded him (as he is only a Contra Mestre), don't seem to have his philosophy at all...but nobody else teaches capoeira in my town...so I have to put up with him (with all due respect). I love capoeira. But I hate biased ranking systems. If I can do MY capoeira moves well, and am actively expanding my skill set, then throw another cordao at me. Don't get mad because I can't do a specific floreio that you like a lot. And that's what my teacher does. If you can't do the floreios he likes, you don't rank up. It's ridiculous. Plus, he ranks up people that never go to class, and never take the time to learn capoeira....but he ranks them up because they help to run the facility that we are renting out. Not only that, but he encourages me to buy capoeira clothes that I either can't wear to class, or just can't wear at all because they took my money and gave me 3 sizes too small. Plus, all of the high-ranking capoeiristas in the group are really pretentious. I just want to freaking play capoeira, and I don't think it should be that hard. I might be a measly aluno verde with only 2 1/2 years of experience, but I deserve the right to play capoeira with my own personal flavor...not my teachers. I can follow rules, but capoeira is about liberation! And my situation is oppressive. I don't want to disrespect my teacher, because I'm grateful that he's shown me capoeira, but I'm honestly thinking of leaving the academy and just playing random street rodas with capoeiristas from the group. I just don't know anymore. I know this is about Jon, but I'm experiencing something similar, so I thought I'd post this in here.
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Permalink Reply by RONIN Capoeirista on -
In order to make capoeira official Mestre Bimba had to set up a cordel system and structure..hence titles. I don't like them but I accept them..I still have my green I don't want anymore colors.
the actual uniforms were involve in Mestre bimba's decisions as well to make it more official. White is also the color of pure or purity thus taking away the street image from capoeira. Besides the actual close was more decendant from slave univorms and not from religion.
The songs I definately don't agree with but it's whats been around capoeira...in brazil...so it will be used in the US since it has no replacement. besides capoeira is open to expresion...make your own songs..and if you do your research you'll find songs that don't mention GOD"S..or just sing the song and replace it with something else..
The Roda is probably the only thing that is "traditional in capoeira". Those implied rules are to keep a level playing field. Capoeira is about deception and loose clothing might give you an edge. The street capoeira was like that..hiding knives or blades or some sort of weapon.
So lighten up. I do capoeira because I love it and not the baggage that it comes with. try to get some people close to you and make an impromptu group.. Respect its History and were it came from and Make some of it for yourself. Where in the US not brazil...
Peace
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Permalink Reply by Pavio Preto on
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And that's what I wanna do! Impromptu groups sound SO good. But I'm afraid of establishing just like a club or anything because I'm still on my green cord.
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Pavio, you seem to be sooo much like me with capoeira haha... i know it sucks esppecially being that your group is the only one around.
can i ask, do you train capoeira for the martial aspect, or dance part, both, or just seeking an outlet to express that involves music & movement? maybe try dancing!! check out my music & dance website: http://www.deephousevibes.com/
there is a video below with sample footage of the sort of dance im doing out here in New York, primarily done to house music, the beauty of this (house) music and dance culture is that you really bring whatever you want to the dance floor and it is generally accepted! kind of like no boundaries... no rules for the movement... hear the music, and just move... do whatever you want, freeyourself!! thats the idea!! (in the video, look out for the macaco, and alittle bit of Role's, Kick, and even rastera's see if you can find'em ; )
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Permalink Reply by Pavio Preto on
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Haha yeah, we are pretty similar. But I started capoeira because I am a fighter, am naturally pretty flexible, and have a good sense of rhythm, and good reflexes...I wanted a martial art that was synonymous to my ethnic background. The main reason was because of the African influence in capoeira....and the only reasons I hold onto it now (despite the millions of things that drive me crazy about it) is that it's a lot of fun, is synonymous to my ethnic background, and helps me improve myself physical/mentally/spiritually. But those good aspects aren't always present. So otherwise, I'm entirely fed up with the jogo, sadly. I need inspiration.
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o here is another video!! my personal favorite! myself and my two dance buddys all trained Capoeira! http://www.facebook.com/v/117853598071
check it out!
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